DODC rules

[js1]

On the forums at Bills web sight he is asking what the racers want. If you want dodc rules let him know.

[ed gaines]

in 13.5 they want to control your esc settings, meaning you can not use nothing newer then v200 on tekin.

[Big bill]

This is the way we ran last year at my track. Tekin's are allowed in 13.5 classes on weekly races, but must use v-200 and less same as last year.
Big Bill

[crazytony]

DODC RULES :thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup: :thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup: :thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:

[BigT]

Thanks Bill at least you will let us run them!

[ed gaines]

Cool :thumbsup:, My bad. I did not know that.Going to have to buy a new LM car again:D

[Denez]

This is what the 4-tracks should do it will draw many more cars . Bill did the right decision on this it will bring more cars more $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

[jenzorace]

Hell Im happy!:D

[BigT]

This is the way we ran last year at my track. Tekin's are allowed in 13.5 classes on weekly races, but must use v-200 and less same as last year.
Big Bill


Hey Bill will we be able to run 203 software in the mod Lm class?

[Big bill]

Yes, you sure can run them in Mod. LM and in Mod. Sprint.

[BigT]

Awesome thanks Bill.

[MK Race]

So how are the cars going to teched? After each race or just somebody that goes real fast because they forgot that the 203 software was on? I'm not saying that anybody would cheat, but from what I've heard some guys actually put the wrong batteries in the car, twice.

Hey Denez, now you and Ed won't have to get those cheater stickers made.:thumbsup:

[BigT]

I personal feel that Bill has ran his program with the Honor system. If it looks or you create attention to yourself you will have a problem. There will be plenty of laptops and netbooks for teching if there needed.

[Big bill]

Sorry about that.

Mike,

It will be up to you guys. it is called the Honor system.
Another way to tech the cars is to ramdonly check cars like first ,third and 6th.
also I can watch the fast times, Say you are TQ your fast lap was 3.895 and another racer starts putting down faster times than TQ has this car will automatically be teched. If cheating will be disqualified. First place and TQ's will always be tecked and word of mouth.

Big Bill

[ed gaines]

Mike me cheat never,But I caught you and few others at a regional race:thumbsup:

[MK Race]

Mike me cheat never,But I caught you and few others at a regional race:thumbsup:

When was that Ed?

[MK Race]

Oh I know what you're talking about. Sorry Ed, I was one of the few guys that was within the rules. Glad you guys all complained, I ran better the next day.

[Denez]

Mike that almost pissed me off I don't cheat I won't if it comes down to cheat to win I will take up something else . I know of people getting caught also and still won the championship, and never batted an eye.

[Denez]

The way I feel you cheat you get caught you go home and don't come back!

[MK Race]

Didn't mean to make it sound like you did cheat. Just the comment you made on the Maryville thread about getting any kind stickers made didn't look good, for you and the person that makes the stickers.

I have seen so many guys cheating over the years just to win a race for nothing.

I have seen so many people complain about fast guys cheating.

Bill is a great guy and is doing what he thinks is best for his racers. Hope it all works for the best.

[JasonAB25]

Just so i have this straight: You can run any speedo you want in the 13.5 classes at Bills weekly and for the four track series races, but not at the other three tracks in the series? I just want to make sure that I and i'm sure some others understand correctly. Also, do you need to have the DODC Batts and motor now too or can you still run the non-stickered stuff? Just want to clear this up to see if I need to spend more of my wifes hard earned money or not:)

[Big bill]

For racing rules - check my website - front page and race info.

At Big Bill's track - we will follow the rules on the 4 track series on September 11th only - this is my turn to host the race of the 4 track series.

Weekly races follow the DODC rules.

Here's to a great racing season - Big Bill

[JasonAB25]

OK, thanks for the heads up Bill, I appreciate it.

Jason

[crazytony]

lm for us 13.5 and mod :thumbsup:

[jenzorace]

Ive got the equipment for checking motors. I can help tech.

[suprcop67]

Ive got the equipment for checking motors. I can help tech.


sweet :thumbsup:

[ed gaines]

Ive got the equipment for checking motors. I can help tech.

And we will start with you first;)

[jenzorace]

And we will start with you first;)
No problem!!:D

[MK Race]

So you're going to run DODC rules?

Does that mean I have to go out and buy new batteries with the DODC Legal stickers? On the website it says DODC or 13.5 SS motor.

Does the motor have to have a legal sticker too?

The website lists the legal speedcontrollers but doesn't mention the LRP SPX that has been out for a couple of years now and is not programable like the Tekin. I have one that I've been using and really don't want to have to buy a Tekin.
Also what about the Mamba speedo? Hmmm?????? I haven't heard anybody asking about it? It's almost the same as the Tekin in the way it can be programmed and it's cheaper.

The rules also say you can run gearbox or direct drive. Is that right?

Thanks.

[jenzorace]

Im sure that speedo is legal. Klyber says there slow. Good enuff for you!:D

[punisher]

It looks like Bill has done his home work. By running dodc rules, it lets people that have the high dollar speed controls run so they don't have to go out and buy a new esc. All they have to do is detune the software. No big deal. That way if people want to go somewhere else that lets you run the new software, they can. And for those that have the lower dollar esc, they can run competatively. And alot of tracks will let you run either the smc or dodc batteries. Same with the motors. Its not locking you into just buying dodc equipment. But it would be smart to purchase the dodc side of things so if you do go to a national event, you will already have the equipment. It also allows some brand of cars to be run that don't have a three gear transmission. Yes dd, belt drive, chaindrive, dynotech cars, and what ever else to run that are legal at most dodc events are ok to race. By doing this it helps everyone. It gives them a place to race. It pretty much allows anyone to race without buying a bunch of equipment and only being able to race at 3 places. I applaud Bill for doing this because its a win win situation for everyone that wants to race.

[jenzorace]

Thanks for understanding.

[MK Race]

So punisher, how many Series races or DODC races did you go to last year?

So if punisher is right it is pretty much run what you want except for the body and tire rules. So the class that started as a cheap class to have some fun racing in is going to turn out to be how much you want to spend will determine how well you do.

[punisher]

why do you think it will be a run what you want, spend alot class?

[MK Race]

why do you think it will be a run what you want, spend alot class?

Well lets see.

Speedo. Series rules, I can pick up a used GTB or LRP pretty cheap. DODC, I have to buy one of the newer speedos.

Drivetrain: directdrive, chaindrive vs gearbox?
On a track like Bill's with high bite you get the directdrive hooked up and you're gone.

Everybody was saying DODC rules. So now you can run batteries and motors without being Official DODC stuff.

[MK Race]

So how many races did you go to?

[BigT]

So if punisher is right it is pretty much run what you want except for the body and tire rules. So the class that started as a cheap class to have some fun racing in is going to turn out to be how much you want to spend will determine how well you do.

I personally think that Bill is running the rules that were ran last year. A lot of his regulars ran TEKIN RS/RS Pro speed control it would of helped or hurt his business to go with the series rules. Bill has a lot of support from his weekly racers.. Its time to go racing...


MY 2 cents

Tom Mc.

[JasonAB25]

I can't wait till the first person gets one of their computer programmer buddies or themselves to get their Tekin to say it is running v200, when it's actually running something else. Then guys will be stuffing the Tekin inside a GTB case and so on. I think if you are going to allow them, you might as well let em run whatever is new and great and just be done with it and not have to worry about teching it. There are going to be guys that try and stretch it to win.

I'll run mod if/when I make it to bills and run the 13.5 stuff for the series. I can always throw more motor at my GTB and not have to buy a Tekin to run there. I don't race enough right now to justify buying a couple new $200 speedos. There is not a single track owner in this country that is going to please everyone. If Bill thinks this will work for him, then it probably will. He knows what his racers want more than those of us that don't race there regularly.

As far as the DODC rules, from what I understand they were put in place to as a guideline for tracks to follow and they were free to adjust the rules as they see fit to accomodate their racers. This is what all of the IL tracks are doing from what i can tell. It seems to me that the only tracks that strictly enforce the DODC rules are the foam tire tracks on the east coast and Bumps and Jumps.

[punisher]

Do you have a esc now? Just run it. If everyones "high dollar esc" are detuned, what difference will it make? If you already have a tekin, or mamba, or what ever, then yes you will have to buy a new esc to run the wcis rules.

As far as the drive train, dd and gearbox are equal. A gearbox won the open wheel this year in 13.5, according to Cutman. And I believe a gearbox won 17.5 classes at teas last month.

You can run the same batteries as you would running wcis rules. I think it was good to do this at the Big Bills track to make it benefit the racers who have smc and dodc batteries. Its the same battery. Alot of dodc tracks do this.

I've been running for close to 30 years. How about you?

[punisher]

Thats kind of where the honor system comes into play. If you have to cheat to win, don't race.

[MK Race]

I've been racing for only 25 years and ran a race track for almost 10 years. I have seen it all. We could start a long thread just on cheating and name people but that wouldn't be anything positive to the hobby.

So where do you race at? Maybe we have races together somewhere?

[ed gaines]

Why did maryville and allens stop running dodc rules for 2010 ?

Now to race at either track you HAVE to buy a esc:thumbsdown:

[JasonAB25]

Aren't we done with this? Where is my beating a dead horse smilie at:)

[AscotConversion]

The only bad thing about allowing the Tekin, even with v200, is that it has WAY more static timing than the LRP Sphere Comp, and the Novaks have zero timing. I am not talking turbo boost, just static timing from the ESC. v183 would be a better choice.

[MK Race]

Im sure that speedo is legal. Klyber says there slow. Good enuff for you!:D

So Jenzo, you're saying my LRP SPX is slower than the Tekin. I would say my LPX is faster than the GTB. So if you want to run at Bill's with the new rules and you already have a GTB in the car from year, you should buy a new Mamba or Tekin or you won't be happy.

[MK Race]

Why did maryville and allens stop running dodc rules for 2010 ?

Now to race at either track you HAVE to buy a esc:thumbsdown:

I think Maryville and Allen's ran the WCIS rules last year, at least with the sprint cars. Seems there was a little talk about the wing rules last year.

If you ran the in the class last year and had a GTB or Sphere then you don't have to buy a new speedo to race at either track. If you want to be competitive at Bill's and you have a GTB, then yes you might want to buy a new Mamba.

[MK Race]

Hey BigT, how many times last year did you race at Maryville, Allen's, Roberts, or Bill's?

Looks like maybe 1 time at Maryville and Allen's for the WCIS race.

So if they run DODC rules this year you'll be at these tracks alot?

[MK Race]

The only bad thing about allowing the Tekin, even with v200, is that it has WAY more static timing than the LRP Sphere Comp, and the Novaks have zero timing. I am not talking turbo boost, just static timing from the ESC. v183 would be a better choice.


Bingo....ding ding ding....we have a winner!

[MK Race]

Hey punisher, you've been racing 30 years and you just now signup for DODC?

Where you been?

[ed gaines]

I think Maryville and Allen's ran the WCIS rules last year, at least with the sprint cars. Seems there was a little talk about the wing rules last year.

If you ran the in the class last year and had a GTB or Sphere then you don't have to buy a new speedo to race at either track. If you want to be competitive at Bill's and you have a GTB, then yes you might want to buy a new Mamba.


SC rules at maryville,allens was dodc. you could not run the cw wing at those tracks.but still used dodc rules.

Last year tekin was legal,by changing the rules to make it illegal for this year. now anybody that runs that class has to buy a esc once again:thumbsdown:

Why do you need to have a tekin,mamba, to be competitive at bills?

[MK Race]

Why do you need to have a tekin,mamba, to be competitive at bills?

Well Ed, from racing on the carpet this winter it gives you good chance to see the difference. Guys that started the season with GTBs had to buy either the Tekin or the LRP SPX or SXX TC. You can change the timing in the speedo and the GTB you can't. At first the GTB thought they could just gear different, but that didn't work. At Glidescope, on the small oval, the Tekin with the 203 version was at least 2 laps faster than the SPX. The Mamba was almost 3 laps faster.

[ed gaines]

Well Ed, from racing on the carpet this winter it gives you good chance to see the difference. Guys that started the season with GTBs had to buy either the Tekin or the LRP SPX or SXX TC. You can change the timing in the speedo and the GTB you can't. At first the GTB thought they could just gear different, but that didn't work. At Glidescope, on the small oval, the Tekin with the 203 version was at least 2 laps faster than the SPX. The Mamba was almost 3 laps faster.


That still wont make you faster at bills.

[JasonAB25]

Why do you think the series won't let you run them in the 13.5 classes if it doesn't have an advantage? Why did Bill limit the software that you can run at his track?

[ed gaines]

because there to cheap to buy one, so they change the rules to fit them only answer i know. the esc does not have magic fairy dust. It will not make you a better driver.

That's where most are confused thinking that the esc will start bring wins,sorry not going to happen the fast guys will be fast no matter what they use.

[BigT]

Hey BigT, how many times last year did you race at Maryville, Allen's, Roberts, or Bill's?

Looks like maybe 1 time at Maryville and Allen's for the WCIS race.

So if they run DODC rules this year you'll be at these tracks alot?

Yes MK only 1 time at Allen's and Maryville only because Bill's was closed for the series races. I ran a Mamba max system Last year with a 5700 motor can't plug a 13.5 novak in to it . BUT as for Bil's I was there every other weekend.

[AscotConversion]

because there to cheap to buy one, so they change the rules to fit them only answer i know. the esc does not have magic fairy dust. It will not make you a better driver.

That's where most are confused thinking that the esc will start bring wins,sorry not going to happen the fast guys will be fast no matter what they use.

With loose dirt, I have no idea how much faster, if at all, the Tekin would be.

I can tell you first hand v203 is vastly quicker in a sedan or 1/12 car. The paved/carpet oval guys report the same.

It won't make anyone drive better, but it will make the have-nots much slower.

[MiniT21]

because there to cheap to buy one, so they change the rules to fit them only answer i know. the esc does not have magic fairy dust. It will not make you a better driver.

That's where most are confused thinking that the esc will start bring wins,sorry not going to happen the fast guys will be fast no matter what they use.

Only thing i got for that is... It may not make the average guy slower... but it will make that good driver that much faster. Which puts him even further out of reach for the average guy.
Just my .02

[ed gaines]

Only thing i got for that is... It may not make the average guy slower... but it will make that good driver that much faster. Which puts him even further out of reach for the average guy.
Just my .02


Don't you have a SC to build:ha:

[rccars4scott]

Only thing i got for that is... It may not make the average guy slower... but it will make that good driver that much faster. Which puts him even further out of reach for the average guy.
Just my .02

Well said Matt, therein lies the real truth of the matter. The fast guys will get faster, the guys that were a lap or two off the pace will now be three.

If I were still doing this, the next logical step when you have esc's with the level of programming that they have now is a data logger (i think novak has one, i know eagle tree does) to monitor motor performance during a run (now we can keep track of motor rpm, amp draw, max voltage, real-time throttle position changes, motor temp). With this data you can set up a nice excel spread sheet to monitor motor performance for all those factors and compare them run to run and correlate them to changes in speed control settings. This is all good and fine in an open class (like sprint cars) but why in a "sportsman" class like 13.5 classes.

Doesn't this all sound fun, RC cars hooked to computers more than they are on the track? I don't know all of the guys by their screen names who are campaigning for the new esc's but I know a few and you guys might want to re-consider heading down this path.

REASON FOR EDIT: Forgot the point I was trying to make.

Where I was headed with this before my hasty "post reply" was that when all of this becomes more work than fun guys drop out (those of us with silicone all over our fingers in the past have seen it before). Try to find a way to keep it fun guys.

[MK Race]

because there to cheap to buy one, so they change the rules to fit them only answer i know. the esc does not have magic fairy dust. It will not make you a better driver.

That's where most are confused thinking that the esc will start bring wins,sorry not going to happen the fast guys will be fast no matter what they use.

Ok Mr. Moneybags, not everybody has deep pockets or pocketbooks in your case. I think the class started out as something to get into with the person that has a budget. So now you want to turn into how much can we spend class. You have the mod sprint class that you can use to dig way down into that purse and spend till you win.

You see things a bit different than a lot of people when it comes to winning too. The speedo alone will not gets all those wins. How many races did you win last year? You had the big Series win at Maryville, the speedo didn't give you the win there and you and Jay won alot at the SMAC track. Alot of guys realize they don't have what it takes to win, they might be racing just to make the A main. Maybe some of the guys that were close to or did make the A main in this class are going to have a harder time this year because of the class of drivers coming into their class. Now they're racing with last years equipment because they have a family to support and racing is low budget to them. They might be happy to make the Bmain until they realize they just got bumped to the Cmain by a no talent driver who spent more than he did. I know, tell him to quit or spend more money to keep up. WRONG. Maybe tell him move to a more sportsman class. WRONG. Oh wait, this was a sportsman class. So if you're going to move to a class where the guys were racing to have fun, why not run the rules that the majority of them want to run instead of telling them to spend more money.

[AscotConversion]

Make v183 the rule for the Tekin and these problems go away.

[Denez]

Looking for a cheap gtb hope there is one somewhere the demand is going up thanks guys for the imput will contact asap

[ed gaines]

Ok Mr. Moneybags, not everybody has deep pockets or pocketbooks in your case. I think the class started out as something to get into with the person that has a budget. So now you want to turn into how much can we spend class. You have the mod sprint class that you can use to dig way down into that purse and spend till you win.

You see things a bit different than a lot of people when it comes to winning too. The speedo alone will not gets all those wins. How many races did you win last year? You had the big Series win at Maryville, the speedo didn't give you the win there and you and Jay won alot at the SMAC track. Alot of guys realize they don't have what it takes to win, they might be racing just to make the A main. Maybe some of the guys that were close to or did make the A main in this class are going to have a harder time this year because of the class of drivers coming into their class. Now they're racing with last years equipment because they have a family to support and racing is low budget to them. They might be happy to make the Bmain until they realize they just got bumped to the Cmain by a no talent driver who spent more than he did. I know, tell him to quit or spend more money to keep up. WRONG. Maybe tell him move to a more sportsman class. WRONG. Oh wait, this was a sportsman class. So if you're going to move to a class where the guys were racing to have fun, why not run the rules that the majority of them want to run instead of telling them to spend more money.



why do you keep bringing money up,when a LM kit cost over $400,How is 13.5lm a sportsman class.

[MK Race]

Hey Ed, how many of those guys do you think went out to buy a new kit to run that class? You just assume they all bought $400 dollar kits. I'm putting a used GBX rear on my 15 year old Intimidator.

[ed gaines]

7 people off the top of my head,And 4 are HD 2.0

And know I not assuming when the people bring there new cars to smac track.

[MK Race]

7 people off the top of my head,And 4 are HD 2.0

And know I not assuming when the people bring there new cars to smac track.

SMAC track? How many of the guys that ran that class last year even know where SMAC is?

[ed gaines]

Since nobody ran lm last year at marville -0

[MK Race]

Maybe 15 guys that ran the WCIS series last year. Looks like it would be changing the rules for them.

[MiniT21]

Make v183 the rule for the Tekin and these problems go away.


Problem with this is, i was told that by holding buttons on the esc you can reset to a default... I don't know as i've always ran LRP, I just bought my first non LRP speed control for my sprint.

[ed gaines]

I don't care about the wcis rules never had an issue with those,its about club racing.

[suprcop67]

Hey Ed, how many of those guys do you think went out to buy a new kit to run that class? You just assume they all bought $400 dollar kits. I'm putting a used GBX rear on my 15 year old Intimidator.

i have a DD intimidator with the bellyacher conversion that is probably 10 years old. and a 16 year old to wheel it like a madman, this class was started as an entry level class to get people involved in the series. we will run the class no matter what just for the fun of it. i guess if there are people that want to take it that seriously more power to them but i dont want to hear them complain if they think we are too slow and in the way. and Mike Kelm you are my hero

[ed gaines]

none of the tracks ran LM but Bills at club races,of the three tracks I went to.maryville don't even offer the class. Bills always had LM at his club races running dodc rules.

[suprcop67]

none of the tracks ran LM but Bills at club races,of the three tracks I went to.maryville don't even offer the class. Bills always had LM at his club races running dodc rules.

we have several at ripley every week for the last 2 years and more people getting cars for this season

[jenzorace]

Holy wow. Dont you have anything better to do kelm??? You like a month late!

[MK Race]

Holy wow. Dont you have anything better to do kelm??? You like a month late!


I'm done Jenzo. Hope everybody else is too. The tracks have set the rules, so just decide where you want to race.

Now grab a beer and the geetar and play some songs for the doggy.

[Dano628]

I don't have a dog in this fight as I live in New Jersey . But a friend of mine races at Bills and Maryville so I have been following it closely . I understand wanting to keep the cost down . Everybody is looking for an edge there is one sure way to get faster its called practice . I think that Bills has done it the right way DODC rules with a limit on software . Good luck with your up coming season I will be trying to make it out for the Big Money 1/8 LM race .:thumbsup: